-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >From: Lynnie >Newsgroups: alt.support.ex-cult >Subject: Lifespring info wanted >Date: 12 Oct 1995 15:34:11 GMT >Organization: MCCommunicatons >Lines: 9 >Message-ID: <45jchj$6m7@news.onramp.net> >NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.1.149.48 >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K) >X-URL: news:alt.support.ex-cult I posted this before, but I'm not sure if it was to this group or not. Several good friends of mine have gotten into Lifespring - they are taking the advanced course this weekend. I have read a LOT about Landmark/Forum/est, but very little about Lifespring. If anyone has specific information about Lifespring, please mail me or post here. I'd like to know about methods, beliefs, etc. Please no other "similar" groups, because I have information about other groups. Thanks! >From: sight@teleport.com (you) >Newsgroups: alt.self-improve >Subject: Lifespring! >Date: 15 Oct 1995 23:59:40 -0700 >Organization: Teleport - Portland's Public Access (503) 220-1016 >Lines: 25 >Message-ID: <45svss$5u6@linda.teleport.com> >NNTP-Posting-Host: linda.teleport.com I would be happy to answer anyone's questions concerning Lifespring. I went throught the first two trainings (Basic and Advanced) in September of 1990 and my attitude towards life did a complete about face since then. It's fantastic! I can't wait to audit basic training down in San Francisco (which is free btw once you've completed basic the first time). Sure it seems strange and weird from the outside but I assure you the trainings are completely effective and logical once your fortunate to experience one. The key to the trainings is to explore your own psyche through intimate and usually intense exercises/interactions with your fellow students. Everything that I gained (and I gained alot from these trainings) came through my own experiences and NOT through anything related to a "Lifespring Philosophy", which really doesn't even exist. LS is truly about SELF-help and a really beautiful experience. Cheers, Mike - -- sight@teleport.COM Public Access User --- Not affiliated with Teleport Public Access UNIX and Internet at (503) 220-1016 (2400-28800, N81) >From: Arun Malik >Newsgroups: alt.support.ex-cult,alt.self-improve >Subject: Re: Lifespring info wanted >Date: 16 Oct 1995 03:14:58 GMT >Organization: Visual Renaissance, Inc. >Lines: 298 >Message-ID: <45sini$6t@sundog.tiac.net> >References: <45jchj$6m7@news.onramp.net> >NNTP-Posting-Host: vri.tiac.net >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Windows; I; 16bit) >To: lynnie_henderson@mccom.com >Xref: news2.delphi.com alt.support.ex-cult:3125 alt.self-improve:9383 Lynnie wrote: >I posted this before, but I'm not sure if it was to this group or not. >Several good friends of mine have gotten into Lifespring - they are >taking the advanced course this weekend. I have read a LOT about >Landmark/Forum/est, but very little about Lifespring. If anyone has >specific information about Lifespring, please mail me or post here. I'd >like to know about methods, beliefs, etc. Please no other "similar" >groups, because I have information about other groups. Thanks! > > I've collected some previous posts about Lifespring for you. Some positive, some negative. Others in this news group may also add more material over time. First I'll list the negative messages - then close it off with a positive msg from a FAQ file. I don't know enough about it to tell you one way or another whether it is a destructive cult or just an overly intense self-help group. Sincerely, Arun Malik (mailed and posted) Xref: digex.com misc.education:3620 dc.general:2999 soc.college:4830 Newsgroups: misc.education,dc.general,soc.college Path: digex.com!uunet!haven.umd.edu!wam.umd.edu!sorsha From: sorsha@wam.umd.edu (Laurie Beth Brunner) Subject: Re: LIFESPRING (Was Re: Call For Information -- Active Cults) Message-ID: <1992Nov8.075500.19783@wam.umd.edu> Sender: usenet@wam.umd.edu (USENET News system) Nntp-Posting-Host: rac2.wam.umd.edu Reply-To: sorsha@wam.umd.edu (Laurie Beth Brunner) Organization: University of Maryland, College Park References: <1992Oct28.210032.11851@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> <1992Oct30.212235.12860@nntpd.lkg.dec.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 07:55:00 GMT Lines: 47 I also went through the Lifespring training, and I managed to get suckered into the second program, basically because someone paid for me. A friend of my mom told me about it at my mom's suggestion, though my mom didn't know much about it at the time. I had very recently experienced an extremely traumatic breakup with a psycho-ex, so I was pretty vulnerable. The first program was okay. I think it helped me deal with some issues that troubled me because I had so many unresolved feelings after I left my ex. I screamed and cried a lot, and that was good for me then. I also saw a lot of people who were total recluses going in, and they seemed transformed by the end. They had opened up to other people, and I think that they experienced some good. The kicker is that they "interview" you at the end, which really means that they harass you into signing up for the second program. That was an, um, interesting experience. It breaks you down and builds you back up again, like boot camp. It's cathartic in a way, if you have emotions to let out. At the end of the 2nd program, they do their best to get you into the third program. At this point I began to feel alienated from the whole thing. I remember that everyone went around saying whether they were going to keep going, and that I and the others who chose not to were met with significantly less approval from the group. I felt that a number of them had become rather fanatical about it, and that still bothers me. I don't feel much different now, 2 years later, than I did then. The one big difference it made in my life was to convince me that I needed to tell a certain someone that I loved him as soon as possible. We're engaged now. :) Other than that, I would not choose to associate myself with Lifespring again, nor would I encourage anyone else to do so. It is considered a cult by the Cult Awareness Network, and the big leaders are pretty scary. Werner Ehrhardt, I believe, was the guy who did the est programs, which I understand were scarier than Lifespring. If you read up on him, I can virtually guarantee that you will not like what you read. Be wary of Lifespring. Don't believe their hype. The Giver Goddess - -- Send burnt offerings to....."If love is a grenade,.........Ahead groove...... .sorsha@wam.umd.edu......I'll pull the pin." B-52's....factor five! -Holly.. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: wes@ice.stx.com (John Shepherd) Newsgroups: dc.general Subject: Re: Lifespring? Date: 5 Aug 1993 22:57:39 GMT Organization: Hughes STX, Lanham, MD Lines: 132 Distribution: world Message-ID: <23s394$j4e@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov> References: <6yoq8B1w165w@uujobs.com> Reply-To: wes@ice.stx.com NNTP-Posting-Host: ice.stx.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In article <6yoq8B1w165w@uujobs.com>, tommy@uujobs.com (tommy) writes: > Does anyone have any input concerning Lifespring? Can it really change > my life in a weekend? What are the drawbacks? Is this a scheme? > Really could use some input on this before I jump. Thanx. > > tommy@uujobs.com RUN!!!! RUN FOR YOU LIFE!!!!! DON'T LET THEM GET THEIR HOOKS IN YOU!!! Sorry. Maybe that was uncalled for, but I've gone and checked them out at one of their introductory meetings. Let me tell you about my experience with them. WARNING: This post is fairly long. I probably should have e-mailed this, but it's too late now. I'm not about to retype this whole message. I first got the impression that they want you to swear total allegiance to them when my sister took the course. Her last class was scheduled the evening of super bowl sunday. While I'm not a big fan of football, I figured since it was the championship, I'd watch it. (Besides my brother asked me to tape it and I wasn't sure how to program the VCR to do it while I wasn't there.) Then the night before, my sister asks me to attend a graduation celebration (I didn't know she was taking any class) that was supposed to start at the end of her last class (very close to the start of the game). She was extremely emotional and said this was very important to her, so I eventually told her I'd go. I got there, and it was basically just a bunch of people milling about and chatting while they played uplifting motivational songs, like the theme to 'Rocky', through a PA system. People weren't really sticking around for any celebration that I could see.I stayed for 5 minutes, then left. I was pretty angry that I had driven all that way for nothing. About a week later, she tells me that she has to go to a post-graduation meeting and she's *required* to bring somebody with her. (All along she's telling me how great Lifespring was for her, and that I should sign up). I figure, what the hell I'll go and listen, and see what the hell she's so excited about. When I got there, all the guests were brought into one banquet hall, and the 'graduates' were taken elsewhere. We were given a spiel about how lifespring can change your life for you and help you realize your full potential if you would just sign up and pay the couple hundred dollars tuition (I don't remember the price, but it ain't cheap). During this 'meeting', they sit you down with a lifespring graduate from a different class, and try to get you to specify some unreached goals. Then whatever those goals are they try and convince you that they can help you achieve them. The only goal I had was to eliminate some debts. And they had the audacity to tell me that if I spent the money to take the course, they could help me achieve that goal. "Do you have a credit card? You could use that to pay your tuition." Eventually, the 'meeting' broke up and they let the people you came with come back in and try and talk you into it. I kept holding my ground, until my sisters friend (the one who got her involved) volunteered to front me the money for the non-refundable deposit. I swore to him that I couldn't come come up with the rest, or pay him back, but he insisted, so I figured, what the hell, if it isn't costing me anything, what can I lose. They started calling me at work the following week, asking me things like, was I thinking about what I was going to focus on when I took the course, what do I want to change for or about myself. Quite frankly, the answer was nothing. Not that I thought I was perfect, but life was going pretty good for me at that time. I couldn't complain. The woman from lifespring would say, "Well think about it and call me back when you come up with something." It started to get annoying. Then a short while before I was supposed to start attending classes, the band I'm playing in got scheduled to play a show at one of the more prestigious clubs in the area. We felt it was an important step for the band, and we were thrilled to have the opportunity. The problem was, it was scheduled for one of the nights that I was supposed to take a class. I called the woman at lifespring and asked if I could take the course at another time and she basically said I couldn't. She said something like, if I missed a class, I couldn't graduate, but I could go through the entire course again and then graduate after that. However, if I missed the first class, or didn't attend any, then I would basically be out of luck. She recommended that I reschedule the band's gig. (If any of you are familiar with playing in bands on the local level, you're probably already laughing aloud at that idea. Suffice it to say that, there was no way in hell I was gonna give up that gig.) "Just explain it to them",she said. "They'll understand". (Lady, you crack me up.) Needless to say that was the last I had to do with Lifespring. (Oh yeah, we had a great show, and were invited back to play several times since.) Anyhow, it seems obvious to me that they want you to become a hardcore Lifespring fanatic, and drop all other obligations or desires for the opportunity to attend their functions and give them your money. Not only do they expect you to miss major events like the superbowl (well to a lot of people at least. They'd probably schedule a class on New Year's Eve), but they were expecting me to pass on a major career opportunity not only for myself, but for my whole band. My sister has gone through a couple of 'advanced' courses since, and she's still into it, but it seems to me like she's spending a lot of money for nothing. If you want to change your life, start an exercise program, learn to play guitar, take a photography class. Pick a hobby and become great at it. You don't need to pay a bunch of people to stand in a room and tell you your ok. \ ==============================================================================> ______ ____________________ / / __ _ _ _ _ /__ _ _ ___ __ _ _ ___ __ __ ___/ /_/ _/--/ _/\_/ ___/ _/--/ _/_- _/-' _/--/ _/_- _/-<,_/__> wes@ice.stx.com (John Shepherd) Hughes STX, Lanham, MD Positive msg about Lifespring ----- DISCLAIMER This file is a collection of Frequently Asked Questions from the alt.self-improve group. This document is information collected by the editors for public use. The information is not guaranteed to be accurate and may not reflect the opinions of the editors, the editor's employers, or associated institutions. This document may be freely distributed provided this disclaimer is included with all copies. This FAQ is also available via World Wide Web (Mosaic): http://diogenes.cs.clemson.edu/~llarsen/llarsen.html 13. Lifespring Q. What is Lifespring? A. From: jmd@bear.com (Josh Glazenburg-Diamond) Hi! Josh Diamond here. I am a graduate of the entire Lifespring program -- I took the trainings back in 1990, and found them to be incredibly valuable.I work as an investment analyst at Bear Stearns & Co. -- an investment bank in New York City. I came into the Lifespring trainings looking for breakthroughs in my career and in personal relationships (esp. with women), and all I can say is that since then I have more than tripled my income, and gotten married to a truly wonderful and beautiful woman (amongst other things). We just bought a co-op, and will be having our first child next year. My wife has also done the trainings, as have several of my friends and co-workers. Lifespring, EST, and a few other such trainings all have a common lineage. The basis was a research program at Stanford University back in the early 70's. This spawned an organization called Mind Dynamics, which later split up into Lifespring, EST, and the others. EST eventuaually mutated into Warner-Earhardt and then Landmark Education -- with a program now called The Forum. Lifespring kept its name, but has undergone continuous modernization as new techniques in personal growth have emerged. There are now Basic and Advanced trainings, as well as several other workshops and programs. The Lifespring trainings are an opportunity to uncover and redesign the underlying assumptions out of which you live your life such that you experience a profound shift in your ability to relate to yourself and others, empowering you to fully engage your heartfelt commitments with freedom and passion. Participants often invite friends to a guest event -- a free evening designed to allow you to learn about what the training is and how it can support you. It provides a small preview of the training experience. At the end of the evening you are given an opportunity to enroll in the training. At the moment I believe that the tuition in New York City $495, with a 100% money back guarantee. It may be lower elsewhere (it was when I took the trainings). I would say that it is worth attending. You can leave at any time, and there is no obligation to pay if you just attend the guest event. Oh, BTW, people who enroll their friends in the trainings do _not_ get any rewards for it (no tupperware or toaster-ovens). Mostly people bring guests to these evenings because they see some breakthrough possible for them -- not like something is broken, but like a higher possibility exists -- maybe something that had not been thought of before. Often our friends see things that we do not. Your friend probably sees some possibility for you in the training, and that is why they have invited you. I say take the chance and go for it. >From: pax33@aol.com (Pax33) >Newsgroups: alt.support.ex-cult >Subject: Re: Lifespring info wanted >Date: 16 Oct 1995 06:27:52 -0400 >Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) >Lines: 3 >Sender: root@newsbf02.news.aol.com >Message-ID: <45tc38$8dl@newsbf02.news.aol.com> >References: <45jchj$6m7@news.onramp.net> >NNTP-Posting-Host: newsbf02.mail.aol.com >X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader there are many resources on this DEFINITE CULT group....go to the web page on "ex-Cults..",,,I also have a friend in Northern Ca who got sucked into this cult and his life is unravelling....good luck! -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.8 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBOrOaJzL5APkWv2amEQJ9eACfZt6Gp6numqTpIMC5ErgpH4P6RSAAni/B 9vc1WyjOPBnJrGxloY/3fXNP =cL2d -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----