We want Information! Why didn't A&E distinguish the original set 2 DVDs from the new ones with the improved audio tracks? Why are the replacements they send to some people (me especially :-) just as bad as the originals? How did they wind up getting the old and new ones all mixed up? What can be done about it?
Some results are in!
I just got my (third :-) replacement DVDs from A&E, and these actually sound OK (at least a couple of places I sampled did, I haven't watched them all the way through yet, I wanted to get this page updated as soon as possible). Thanks to the internet volunteers who made this quest for information possible.
The quick answer is that the numbers printed around the hub on the back of the DVD are different for the new sets. The good sets look like:
Vol. 3: DVSS-026090A1 <gap> 6 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> AXX Vol. 4: DVSS-025990A1 <gap> 2 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> AXX
That single digit 6 or 2 in the middle is the key (the final number shown here as AXX seems to vary quite a bit from disk to disk, so you can ignore it). Is it mere chance that the numbers on the good disks are 6 and 2? I don't think so :-).
The bad sets look like:
Vol. 3: DVSS-026090A1 <gap> 3 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> AXX Vol. 4: DVSS-025990A1 <gap> 1 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> AXX
Note the single digit 3 and 1 on the bad disks.
If you put it in a computer and run a DIR command, the volume label for Vol. 4 says "PRISONER4" instead of "THE_PRISONER4" (although Vol. 3 still says "THE_PRISONER3"). This screwed up my dvdsum program (which was looking for the labels), so it has been updated to be more flexible about what it checks.
Finally, the checksums which dvdsum computes really are different. The output I get for the good disks is:
Volume Label: THE_PRISONER3
Volume Serial: 539c243d
Filename: VTS_01_0.VOB
Create Time: high=01c08102, low=ce73ff00
Access Time: high=01c08102, low=ce73ff00
Write Time: high=01c08102, low=ce73ff00
Size: high=00000000, low=02969000
Filename: VTS_01_1.VOB
Create Time: high=01c08103, low=3aeefe00
Access Time: high=01c08103, low=3aeefe00
Write Time: high=01c08103, low=3aeefe00
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffee000
Filename: VTS_01_2.VOB
Create Time: high=01c08103, low=a8029380
Access Time: high=01c08103, low=a8029380
Write Time: high=01c08103, low=a8029380
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffe5800
Filename: VTS_01_3.VOB
Create Time: high=01c08104, low=16dfec80
Access Time: high=01c08104, low=16dfec80
Write Time: high=01c08104, low=16dfec80
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffc1000
Filename: VTS_01_4.VOB
Create Time: high=01c08104, low=4858b800
Access Time: high=01c08104, low=4858b800
Write Time: high=01c08104, low=4858b800
Size: high=00000000, low=1c4dc800
Checksum for THE_PRISONER3: e26a9078ce75e411429172a90297af48
Volume Label: PRISONER4
Volume Serial: ee0812b2
Filename: VTS_01_0.VOB
Create Time: high=01c087f9, low=d534fd00
Access Time: high=01c087f9, low=d534fd00
Write Time: high=01c087f9, low=d534fd00
Size: high=00000000, low=0291d800
Filename: VTS_01_1.VOB
Create Time: high=01c087fa, low=4d9bbe00
Access Time: high=01c087fa, low=4d9bbe00
Write Time: high=01c087fa, low=4d9bbe00
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffe1800
Filename: VTS_01_2.VOB
Create Time: high=01c087fa, low=cac73300
Access Time: high=01c087fa, low=cac73300
Write Time: high=01c087fa, low=cac73300
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffd1000
Filename: VTS_01_3.VOB
Create Time: high=01c087fb, low=504ae300
Access Time: high=01c087fb, low=504ae300
Write Time: high=01c087fb, low=504ae300
Size: high=00000000, low=3ffe6800
Filename: VTS_01_4.VOB
Create Time: high=01c087fb, low=86886280
Access Time: high=01c087fb, low=86886280
Write Time: high=01c087fb, low=86886280
Size: high=00000000, low=1cc1e800
Checksum for PRISONER4: 9913c60133395b102dbfebe4af2757c3
Anyway, it looks like we can indeed tell the difference between good and bad disks with a simple visual exam (but you do have to take them out of the box in a good light), so the checksum stuff is merely interesting to verify that the audio tracks really are different.
You could probably stop reading here, but if you are interested in the complete history, what follows is the rest of the original web page I started out with:
The original story
The sad tale of the audio on DVD set 2 is documented in great detail over on The Prisoner Appreciation Society web pages, so refer to them for more information.
Having just gotten my 2nd replacement set and found that it sounds just like the first replacement set, which, as near as I can remember, sounds just like the originals (which I sent in to A&E so I no longer have those copies to directly compare), I have taken action! A DVD is, after all, just a bunch of numbers on a disk. If the audio tracks are different on some disks, a checksum computed on the whole audio track should come out one way for the original disks and a different way for the disks with the new audio.
I have now written a program (or more accurately, hacked the existing "vobdec" program) to read the audio from Prisoner volume 3 and 4 DVDs and print the checksum as well as any other identifying information it can find (file sizes, write dates, etc). Since the only disks I have all sound bad, I'll need the help of volunteers out in internet land who have good disks to find out if this program can really identify the good and bad disks correctly (it is all theory at the moment, you'll be taking part in an experiment if you volunteer). By gathering enough data, I may discover some quick and easy way to distinguish the disks (this program can take anywhere from 5 minutes to an hour or so to run, depending on the speed of your DVD drive).
Is there anything quick I can check?
Yep. If you don't feel like fooling with all the silly computer checksum stuff I talk about below, you could just take a quick peek at the back of the disk around the hub and report the stuff written there. Here are some scans of the hubs on Vol. 3 and Vol. 4. So far I only have reports on bad disks (I guess people with good disks don't feel the need to fool with all this nonsense, but A&E swears that the third replacement set they will be sending me in a few weeks will really and truly be fixed, so maybe I'll have new numbers then :-). Both my sets say:
Vol. 3: DVSS-026090A1 <gap> 3 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> A03 Vol. 4: DVSS-025990A1 <gap> 1 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> A03I've gotten another report (almost the same) of:
Vol. 3: DVSS-026090A1 <gap> 3 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> A09 Vol. 4: DVSS-025990A1 <gap> 1 <gap> * ** ******** <gap> <reverse> A03(If you can't see the difference, its that A09 on the end instead of A03).
If these numbers happen to distinguish the good and bad sets, it will be a lot simpler than checksumming the audio.
On to the computer stuff:
What You Will Need
If you'd like to volunteer to gather information, here's what you will need:
- A computer (with a DVD drive) running Windows (I've tested on Windows 98 and Windows NT 4.0, and as far as I know it should work just as well on any other flavor of Windows).
- A DVD player program, or at least some kind of program that can "authorize" a DVD (search google for things like "vobdec" or "dodsrip", but I hesitate to provide more explicit pointers due to the hordes of paranoid lawyers out there). By the way, even a demo copy of a DVD player should work since you don't need to play the whole disk.
- You will need to download my dvdsum.exe program, or if you don't like the idea of running random executables off the net, you can download dvdsum.zip which contains the executable along with all the source code, so you can rebuild it yourself if you want to (or if you are just interested in the source).
What To Do
- Download dvdsum.exe and stash it some place on
your computer. For example, let's say you put it in
C:\DVDSUM. - Stick The Prisoner Volume 3 or 4 DVD in your DVD drive. If you have "auto insert" turned on, this will probably automatically start your player program and start playing the DVD. If it does, simply exit out of the DVD player. The disk should now be "authorized" (which means dvdsum.exe can now read it). If the DVD player doesn't automatically start, start it manually and get it playing the DVD, then exit.
- Just to be paranoid, double click on "My Computer" and look at the properties for the DVD drive. Make sure Windows believes the label on the DVD really says the prisoner 3 or 4 (which ever disk you inserted). I have had windows cache the label information from the previous disk and not update it, which gets everyone confused. If it isn't correct, go to the View menu of My Computer and click on Refresh. If it still isn't correct, you may have to right click on the DVD drive icon and tell windows to Eject the disk, then start this process again.
- At last, you are ready to run dvdsum. Open a MSDOS window (or
a Command Prompt as Windows 2000 calls it) and cd to the directory
where you saved the dvdsum program. Run it like this:
C:\DVDSUM>dvdsum > vol3.txt
This command will write the identifying information dvdsum computes to the vol3.txt file and will also print some information to the terminal as it runs. While it runs, it will look something like this:
Found drive H:\ (UDF filesystem) Checksum audio in H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_0.VOB scanning LBA #21000 Checksum audio in H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB scanning LBA #524000 Checksum audio in H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_2.VOB scanning LBA #524000 Checksum audio in H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_3.VOB scanning LBA #524000 Checksum audio in H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_4.VOB scanning LBA #231000
The "scanning LBA..." lines will be refreshed as it runs so you can keep track of the progress and get an idea of how long it will probably take to complete (the numbers above are the final numbers, so it has to work its way up to them for the five separate files it scans).
The vol3.txt file will now have something like this in it:
Volume Label: THE_PRISONER3 Volume Serial: 8094779d Filename: VTS_01_0.VOB Create Time: high=01c021b8, low=f08f5c00 Access Time: high=01c021b8, low=f08f5c00 Write Time: high=01c021b8, low=f08f5c00 Size: high=00000000, low=0296a000 Filename: VTS_01_1.VOB Create Time: high=01c021b9, low=7f9c7400 Access Time: high=01c021b9, low=7f9c7400 Write Time: high=01c021b9, low=7f9c7400 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffee000 Filename: VTS_01_2.VOB Create Time: high=01c021ba, low=11a47c80 Access Time: high=01c021ba, low=11a47c80 Write Time: high=01c021ba, low=11a47c80 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffe5800 Filename: VTS_01_3.VOB Create Time: high=01c021ba, low=a4451b80 Access Time: high=01c021ba, low=a4451b80 Write Time: high=01c021ba, low=a4451b80 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffc1000 Filename: VTS_01_4.VOB Create Time: high=01c021ba, low=de162200 Access Time: high=01c021ba, low=de162200 Write Time: high=01c021ba, low=de162200 Size: high=00000000, low=1c4dc800 Checksum for THE_PRISONER3: 6797641ac75269f44a3d5dce12b7b54fThe above numbers are what I get for my two different copies of the volume 3 DVD on two different computers (actually the Volume Serial and time stamps don't agree - I think they may be random numbers Windows invents). For volume 4 I get:
Volume Label: THE_PRISONER4 Volume Serial: 799a780a Filename: VTS_01_0.VOB Create Time: high=01c01dd9, low=ca914280 Access Time: high=01c01dd9, low=ca914280 Write Time: high=01c01dd9, low=ca914280 Size: high=00000000, low=0291d800 Filename: VTS_01_1.VOB Create Time: high=01c01dda, low=45f2f400 Access Time: high=01c01dda, low=45f2f400 Write Time: high=01c01dda, low=45f2f400 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffb7800 Filename: VTS_01_2.VOB Create Time: high=01c01dda, low=c6195980 Access Time: high=01c01dda, low=c6195980 Write Time: high=01c01dda, low=c6195980 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffd8000 Filename: VTS_01_3.VOB Create Time: high=01c01ddb, low=45a72880 Access Time: high=01c01ddb, low=45a72880 Write Time: high=01c01ddb, low=45a72880 Size: high=00000000, low=3ffea000 Filename: VTS_01_4.VOB Create Time: high=01c01ddb, low=82731f80 Access Time: high=01c01ddb, low=82731f80 Write Time: high=01c01ddb, low=82731f80 Size: high=00000000, low=1cc3e800 Checksum for THE_PRISONER4: a74ff9f76416eabbe65b9171c1d99ad7 - Once you get your output file (vol3.txt, vol4.txt, whatever you happen to name them). Email me Tom.Horsley@worldnet.att.net copies of the files along with your impression of the sound. If you think your disks sound OK, tell me that. If you think they sound bad, tell me that. If you happen to have both a good and a bad set and you can definitely tell the difference listening to them, then by all means send me the numbers from both of them (making sure you keep straight which are the numbers for the good disks and the bad disks :-).
Thanks in advance for any help you can provide (if I get innundated by responses, this may be the only thanks you get, but rest assured I am happy to get your contribution). If it turns out this program doesn't actually work right, and all it computes is garbage, I apoligize in advance for wasting everyone's time :-).
P.S. I'll update this page with new information when and if I figure out anything from the results I get. If you are looking at a copy of this, the original can be found at: http://home.att.net/~Tom.Horsley/set2.html
Acknowledgements
Thanks to Bruce Clark for agitating A&E to fix the bad disks in the first place, and A&E for eventually fixing all their problems.
If there was a race, "Larry" would be the winner with the first report of a checksum on a good disk and "elnac" would win the race for the first report on the numbers on the hub of a good disk.
Other contributors of useful data points include Bill McClain, and W.P. Wily.
If I'm missing anyone, let me know. I apoligize for not including this section earlier, but I just didn't think of it. (Distracted by that awful audio :-).
P.S. I left out email addresses above because I figured no one really wants spammers harvesting their email, but if anyone wants their email added to this section, just let me know.
Version History:
Original Page went up on: June 22nd, 2001.
Updated on July 3rd, 2001 with the DVD hub info.
Updated on July 9th, 2001 with some actual results.
Updated on July 10th, 2001 to add acknowledgements.